thoughts?

Everything he said was on the dot.I,too,am sick and tired of this hardcore/casual gamer thing and he summed up everything I think about it.

That's mah debaser!

Debaser gave us the best explanation to the Casual/Hardcore phenomena that I have ever heard.

Awesome

A decent article with valid points and a solid argument, but I like to think it goes a tad deeper. I consider myself the hardest of the hard. I love a good challenge. I go out of my way to get high scores on whatever remaining arcade machines I can find. I strive to one-life as many of the notoriously difficult NES games as I can manage. Ninja Gaiden? One life. Ninja Gaiden II, III? One life. Rush n' Attack? One life. That's hard muthafuckin' core.

But there's just one problem: the more "complicated" games over the last 10 or so years, supposedly designed to appeal to me if I consider myself "hardcore" often make me end up hating them. Do I consider Final Fantasy VIII or X or XII more complicated than before? Karnov yes. Am I hardcore? Yep. Do I like Final Fantasy VIII, X or XII? FUCK NO. To me, it's all about keeping it simple. If a game has a simple concept but can offer me a worthwhile challenge at the same time, I'm all over it. It could just mean I'm an exception to the rule, but I tend to think there's a bit more to it than "casual" and "hardcore."

Who do I blame? Technology and developers.

I'm not sure I agree with his definition of "hardcore" and casual. I play COD, Halo, and Gears, but I also play Mario, Zelda, Pikmin, and Final Fantasy. So where do I fit in?

I'm not sure he really hit the mark exactly. In my opinion, "hardcore" gamers are the ones that live and breathe games, whether for challenge or fun. I think they're also interested in quality games rather than "serious" ones.

in my opinion his distinction was incorrect, is mario galaxy a 'casual game'?

galaxy was universally applauded by the gaming community, sure it appeals to casual gamers too, but all mario games did.

Plenty of casual gamers love Halo as well, so the examples he gave just seemed weird/wrong to begin with.

I thought it was a good article but.. I do see some flaws in it. But that's fine because it's not a black and white simple kind of topic. You really can't put it into words. But I'll give it a try anyways.

Here's my take on the hole thing,

When we say Hardcore or when we say Causal.. are we really just talking about two demographics? I believe there exists four demographics, two belonging to each word... if that makes any sense. This would best be explained with a chart.

But anyways, the word "Hardcore" represents two different demographics. one being the hardcore gamer who plays Halo, Gears of War, and Call of Duty the more serious "challenging" games.. and the second being the gamer who has been playing games their hole life, is somewhat of a fan boy/girl, collects retro games, or has a lot of gaming knowledge.

Then there is the word "Causal" this one also shares two different definitions, the first being the gamer who likes games but rarely plays, prefers the fun not so complicated games, and manly just wants to have fun.. maybe with their kids or spouse. The other version of Causal is the so called G,ramer who only plays Halo or who only plays Madden and is not considered a "real" gamer... which I happen to find really ridiculous.

So you see, I find when it comes to this argument there are too many different versions of the terms, depending on who you're asking. But yes, I agree the source of the problem and the source of the separation is the second version of hardcore gamers. Who exclude people for liking big franchise game like Halo and Madden. But that's just my take on it, really I don't believe in any of these terms. the way I see it and the way I have always seen it.. If you like video games you're a gamer. there's no levels and there should not exist any separation between us.

noooicely done

I explained the fact that casual gamers like to play that stuff as well. Also, look at the level of competition that the Mario games can create versus the level of competition that my examples create. I know it's all just opinionated work, but I believe that my examples outweigh this argument by a lot.

I don't use the word 'hardcore gamer' in any of my stuff mainly because it's not really a word. It's made up slang and can be stretched to suit anyone's argument.

I put those who are fanboyish and collect a lot of their favorite stuff as just that: fanboys and collectors. I'm a Mortal Kombat fanboy. I collect lots of oldschool stuff because that's what I grew up with. I'm not going to enter a gaming tournament for fear that I'm going to be destroyed by the competition. I'm not very "hardcore" in my gaming syle, but I do play quite often.

I know that others have given their opinions as well, but they normally come off with bad or no examples to back themselves up. I welcome the debate, however.

If I were doing the categorizing, I'd put you in the casual section because while you do enjoy playing games on a regular basis, you show no desire to compete be it local or global. It'd ultimately become opinionated garble after so long, but I think that my examples speak for themselves.

Oh yes. I'll be the first to admit that it goes far deeper than I ventured. But, then again, it's a weekly column, and I'd like to leave you guys to discuss.

One level of hardcore gamer that I haven't mentioned: the speedrunners.

Thank you, sir. I'm glad that you think that highly of my work. It could have been better, but, again, you guys need something to discuss.

no, I don't think you understood what I was doing there. I was just giving my spin on the words alone. what they mean and what they can mean to different people. I don't understand how you interpreted it, but I manly was showing the different definitions the terms can have.

I actually agreed with your article and your examples. I don't acknowledge these terms either.

I was just showing how there's different versions of both terms depending on who you ask, that's all. It was more of a separate topic on terminology than a debate. But then again it was late so I might have been rambling. lol

Ah well, the removal of the word "'hardcore gamer'" from the post makes your opinions far stronger IMO. My apologies for misunderstanding you.

There will be a lot of others who disagree with my opinions and examples 100%, but I welcome them when they arrive. I think of this article as pavement for the road of this discussion. Others could take what I've written and go far deeper into the discussion. I'm actually hoping to read something like that eventually.*

*Also extremely tired after six hour drive. May be rambling.

I've written more about this topic in the past, but in short I just hate both of these buzz words that the media and gamers have picked up on lately. To segregate gamers by two poorly defined terms just seems silly.

But if Halo is a 'hardcore gamers' game how can you account for the fact that millions of non-hardcore gamers have bought/played and enjoy halo?

It's a term that when analysed closely is full of contradictions, but is more just a loose way to make a distinction between gaming enthusiasts and people who lack knowledge of videogames and the industry and play them infrequently.

Dude, let me explain again. I placed it in the hardcore category because it's used as a competitive title locally, nationally, and globally - just like Halo 2. The casual crowd can enjoy the game as well as I stated in the article.

Hey Digital, the jerk st-- ah, fuck it. Nevermind.